LHZB interview special with Dr. Thio Su Mien
“Feminist Mentor” Dr. Thio Su Mien: The “coup” was accidental
The “coup” that occurred at AWARE’s AGM several weeks ago was actually an accident.
At least this was how Dr. Thio Su Mien perceived it.
At the AWARE AGM on March 28th, a twelve-member executive committee (exco) was voted in but the majority of the exco members, including Ms Josie Lau who later took over as president, were new and relatively unknown members. This provoked unease and dissatisfaction amongst the veteran members of AWARE; later, this also sparked a series of tussles between the old guard and new guard of AWARE.
However, Dr. Thio, widely perceived as the one who orchestrated this “coup”, in an interview with this newspaper, claimed that she did not expect the outcome of the AGM elections to result in a new guard taking over as the exco. She also claims that her encouraging of young women to join AWARE was aimed only at injecting new vitality into the organisation and to preserve the core family values of Singaporean society.
According to reports, AWARE’s membership numbers have, in recent years, been declining, reaching a low of 200 members at the end of last year. However, amongst those attending AWARE’s AGM on March 28th, only a minority was long-standing members of AWARE while the majority were new members who joined only shortly before the AGM.
According to Dr. Thio, if the long-standing members of AWARE had all attended the AGM, the new members “may not even have a single chance of winning a position, hence who can we blame for the outcome of the exco elections; even I was not expecting such an outcome”.
In a media report in April, it was revealed that Ms Josie Lau, the new AWARE president, along with another 5 new exco members are from the same church of Church of Our Saviour (COOS) while Dr. Thio is also a member of COOS and a mentor to Ms Lau and company. It was later revealed that Ms Lau is married to Dr. Thio’s nephew. All this were cited as proof of a well-orchestrated “coup” by Dr. Thio.
When reminded of this during the interview, Dr. Thio laughed and said: “If you say that I planned all this, I indeed was the one going around encouraging people I know to join AWARE. But all these people were mobilised at the last moment. Some amongst them did not know one another but only know me; some in fact are not that familiar with me. My purpose was: if you are able to, you should join this organisation and contribute to society”.
She added that if she was indeed the mastermind behind the whole thing, she would not be “as stupid as to find people from the same church”.
“If I really premeditated this, then I would be a real strategist; if so, I should organise a rainbow coalition like them (the old guard of AWARE). However, my thinking was very simple. But now thinking back, I was in fact rather foolish and naïve in my thinking. I never thought that the outcome will be this and that things will get so out of hand”.
On the April 23rd press conference held by the exco headed by Ms Lau, Dr. Thio was present to answer questions on behalf of the exco. At that press conference, Dr. Thio made statements about AWARE’s declining membership numbers, the proposed changes to its constitution to allow for male members to be eligible to vote. Her accusations about AWARE’s Comprehensive Sexuality Education (CSE) programme and about it promoting a homosexual lifestyle were also made at that press conference.
The AWARE saga later attracted more attention from outsiders and supporters of the old guard and this was because of Dr. Thio’s confession that she has been the mentor of the exco for several years and was the one who encouraged them to join AWARE. Also, it was revealed through online sources that Dr. Thio had, before the AGM, sent out mass emails criticising the CSE and encouraging people to vote for “reformers who want to be in charge”.
The question is: why didn’t this retired veteran lawyer personally run for a position on the AWARE exco if she was so concerned about the supposed direction the organisation was heading in?
Dr. Thio, who is already 71 years of age, explained that besides her age, another more important reason why she didn’t personally run for an exco position was that she felt that being a mentor, her responsibility was to nurture people who can make contributions to society and not try to glorify herself.
Similarly, it was because of her role as a mentor that Dr. Thio decided that it was necessary for her to present at the April 23rd press conference to defend Ms Lau and company.
Surprised at the anger and emotions at the EOGM
“I originally only planned to speak at the EOGM but when I saw the exco being lambasted, I felt that I have the responsibility, since I was the one who encouraged them to join AWARE and serve the interests of womenfolk and the nation, to be present at the press conference. I did not expect that they will be attacked and, even worse, that their lives, livelihood and businesses will also come under threat.”
The exco originally has no plans to hold a press conference and had wanted to wait till the EOGM to express their views.
“But”, said Dr. Thio, “the media was having a field day with the AWARE saga so we had to hold a press conference to clarify matters”.
Besides being surprised at the “coup”-like outcome of the AGM, Dr. Thio also expressed great surprise at the sudden increase in membership numbers for AWARE and the intensity of the emotions displayed at the EOGM on May 2nd.
During the 7 hours long EOGM, a scene which is perhaps most memorable to those present and those paying close attention to the happenings at the EOGM would be that of Dr. Thio proudly holding up a publication by AWARE to announce that she is on page 73 of the publication. This act was heavily criticised by the supporters of the old guard present at the EOGM. Dr. Thio’s attempts to rein in the noisy crowd by reminding them that they need to respect their elders also provoked a round of jeers.
Reminded about this during the interview, Dr. Thio expressed surprise: “I never thought that on the day of the EOGM, people’s emotions would be so intense, that the atmosphere will be so filled with anger”.
Nothing to be angry about
However, with regards to being unable to finish her speech due to the jeers, Dr. Thio said that there was nothing to be angry about.
“There is no need to be angry. Being angry will be like playing an old record non-stop”. Dr. Thio feels that if an individual is not able to let go, he or she will only cause him/herself to be trapped in the past and not be able to move on.
Hence, even though her remarks of “Please respect your elders” and “I am on page 73” was printed onto slogan t-shirts, Dr. Thio also laughed it off, saying: “This sort of design is quite interesting and can increase the income for the designer; I also want to buy one to take a look”.
As for what her future plans for herself and her “mentees” will be, Dr. Thio said: “Let’s talk about this after I return from a vacation! Perhaps taking a vacation will inspire me. And hopefully, the anger over this saga will dissipate and Josie will be able to continue using her strengths to contribute to society”.
Box story: “Homosexuality is a political movement”
Been keenly aware of the developments in homosexuality in Europe and North America, Dr. Thio firmly believes that there is a political movement promoting homosexuality. And the aims of this movement will include the de-criminalisation of anal sex. This may be witnessed in the attempts by individuals in Singapore to repeal Section 377A of the local Penal Code.
Dr. Thio said: “This is a significant point. Because if once the law is abolished or liberalised, homosexual activists will start to raise issues, such as marriage equality, education equality, and medical equality, to ask for funds from the government.”
In Finland, singles and lesbians are, with government subsidies, able to receive artificial insemination. This, according to Dr. Thio, will thus involve how taxpayers’ money should be used.
Dr. Thio also cited an example from Canada. According to her, there was a case in Canada in which a kindergarten teacher filed a lawsuit against the school management committee, accusing the committee for not including three books with contents about same-sex parents in the syllabus for kindergarten and primary one students. Although parents from different religious backgrounds, e.g. Hinduism, Sikhism, Catholicism and Christianity, supported the school management committee in the Canadian Supreme Court, the school management committee lose the case and had to put the three books into the school library.
She originally did not want this interview to be published
This interview with Dr. Thio almost did not get published.
Although she readily agreed to be interviewed one week ago, Dr. Thio later wanted to prevent this interview from being published.
As one of the central figures in the AWARE saga, Dr. Thio felt that Deputy Prime Minister and Home Affairs Minister Wong Kan Seng’s statement about the government stance on the AWARE saga and call for individual religious groups and secular organisations to be tolerant and exercise restraint already provided a very good conclusion to the AWARE saga. Thus, she did not want this interview to be published lest it stirs up emotions or polarise society.
Eventually, Dr. Thio was convinced to allow this interview to be published. This was because she knew that the focus of this interview will be the family values she espouses. As she said, one week ago, when she agreed to be interviewed: “If you all want to find out my views on family and values, then we may talk. But if you all want to talk about the AWARE saga, then forget about it”.
The interview was conducted at a restaurant in the Botanical Gardens. The day before the interview (6/5/2009), Dr. Thio attended the 150th anniversary dinner and dialogue session with Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew organised by the Botanical Gardens; amazed by the beauty of the Botanical Gardens, Dr. Thio wanted us journalists to also experience it.
Dressed in a purple floral top and a long skirt, Dr. Thio looked markedly different and softer from how she looked like during the AWARE saga – serious and dressed in proper business attire. Without wasting any time, Dr. Thio proceeded to, through sharing one story after another, express her staunch belief in the core family values which she seeks to protect.
The first story was the “Chicken Egg” story, a story her daughter, Ms Thio Li-Ann, in conjunction with Mothers’ Day, wrote in The New Paper to express her gratitude towards Dr. Thio.
With regards to this story, Dr. Thio said: “I was in disrepute after the AWARE saga, thus I was very moved by Li-Ann’s use of this story to express her respect and support for me; it also shows that she still remembers the meaning behind the story”.
After the end of World War Two, Dr. Thio, who was then only 7 years of age, was visiting her grandmother’s hometown in Fujian along with her parents and siblings. Her relatives there, although they were very poor, will always present Dr. Thio and her family with a big bowl of noodles with an omelette placed on top. Seeing this, Dr. Thio’s father will remind her and her siblings to finish the noodles as although her relatives were poor, they offered them the best. This childhood lesson about respecting others that Dr. Thio’s father imparted to her was a memorable one to Dr. Thio which she later imparted to her own children.
Dr. Thio said: “My parents each had their own personalities and strengths and it was them who provided me with an environment that shaped my character and value system. Hence, I firmly believe that every child should be able to live and grow up in a family with full parental support. A family headed by a same-sex couple will find it difficult to provide children with a conducive environment to best grow up in”.
For the past 10 years and more, Dr. Thio has been involved in church counselling work and once, a father lamented to her that it is most unfortunate that a small golfing ball can alienate a father from his family. This lamentation by this father also illustrated to Dr. Thio the importance that parents have in their children’s lives and education.
“When my children were about 2 to 3 years old, my husband gave me a set of golfing equipment. I went to play a few rounds of golf but I realised that I was neglecting my children. Thus, I decided to throw the golfing equipment into the storeroom and brought my children out for swimming. In the years which I have been doing family counselling, I have also been encouraging parents to bring their children for swimming or cycling to strengthen the bonds between them and their children; don’t play golf. When it comes to discerning what is truly important, we often make mistakes”.
Witnessing the trends and changes in Europe and North America with regards to the family and gender relations, Dr. Thio was more convinced of the paramount importance of family education and that many societies, including Singapore, are facing challenges to their value systems.
Dr. Thio is especially worried about the erosion of values by a movement, originating in the West, that is challenging people’s belief in the family. And this movement, according to Dr. Thio, aims to “basically redefine the meaning of marriage, to redefine marriage as not only belonging to couples of different sexes but also to same-sex couples. This movement aims to legalise same-sex marriage and to redefine the traditional concept of the family”.
“This is a movement which constantly appeals to people to support it. You can recognise its existence but you cannot allow it to become part of the mainstream. Schools should have sex education but this should be done appropriately to preserve our core values about the family”.
And encouraging eligible women to serve and contribute to society is one way that Dr. Thio has been using to preserve the core values of Singaporean society. As the mentor of Ms Josie Lau and others, she often “nags” at them to be more concerned about society at large and “not to be only interested in fashion and handbags”.
This is basically why she encouraged them to join AWARE.
“We cannot depend on the schools and the government for everything. We all understand the need to seriously learn how to be good reporters and lawyers but this is not the case when it comes to learning how to be a good parent. If parents are only concerned their children’ academic grades and leave the rest to maids and society to handle, the family and society will collapse”.
In an interview that spanned 2 hours, two-thirds of the time was spent on discussing the importance of maintaining core values. As the interview came to an end, Dr. Thio said to us journalists: “If I had known you all earlier, I would perhaps also encouraged you all to join AWARE”.
“Why is it that everytime someone offers an opposing view to homosexuality, that person will receive death threats or have his/her livelihood threatened? Does this involve the use of politics of fear? Shouldn’t the media be concerned about this? Shouldn’t we be having a regulatory mechanism to ensure objective and fair reporting by the media?” – On the former exco of AWARE and herself receiving death threats during the AWARE saga
“I am very glad that now there are more people discussing about the issue of sex education and desiring a better vetting process to be put in place for sex education in schools. However, I am not sure how the Education Ministry will oversee the matter, as in how will they check on the teachers, who are crucial figures in sex education, who are teaching sex education? This point will need to be clarified.
Originally, the Education Ministry wanted me to produce evidence for my claims about there being parents complaining about sex education. However, the report in the April 24th edition of The Straits Times and my response letter to the Education Ministry have made it clear that I never said I received complaints from parents. Also, after investigations, the Education Ministry has publicly announced that some sex education programmes have contravened its guiding principles. This shows that my accusations were not inaccurate.
What is comforting is that the Education Ministry has decided to examine how it can enhance its vetting process for sex education. We should improve on the transparency and credibility of this process. A supervisory body should also be specially set up to communicate with and consult parents. Also, perhaps the vetting process should include placing relevant information online as a display of transparency?” – On the Education Ministry announcing on June 7th the suspension of sex education programmes provided by external organisations e.g. AWARE after its initial statement that it did not receive any complaints from parents
“The responsibility of a mentor is to nurture and groom them before allowing them to go out to contribute to society; to allow for the continued increase in the numbers of talented individuals. If you do not let young people to serve in leadership roles but do everything by yourself, this will be most inefficient.” – On why she did not personally run for a position on the AWARE exco
“50% of Singapore’s population consists of women; we actually have an abundance of talent. If we are able to have 10 Mrs. Lim Hwee Hua (Minister in the Prime Minister’s Office), 50 Professor Chan Heng Chee (Singapore’s Ambassador to the United States) or 100 Olivia Lum (CEO of Hyflux), that will be a great blessing. There are two levels to this: firstly, on the societal level, we will need to help those women at the bottom of the social ladder to improve themselves and for those women who are better off, we will have to let them possess more skills and to inspire them to contribute more to society.
We will have to nurture more women leaders in different fields because CEDAW’s target is to have women have 30-35% representation in different fields. I, with my life experiences, should be able to contribute towards this endeavour.” – On why she encouraged more eligible women to join AWARE
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